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Old 09-05-2014, 12:30 PM   #41
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Not Texas Law Shield, but an interesting article none the less:
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Just last month, the California Supreme Court issued an opinion that could cause serious problems for anyone who might find themselves involved in an incident where criminal charges are a possibility. Understandably, in such limited space, I can only attempt to summarize the decision, based on the opinions of experienced criminal trial attorneys who have generously offered their assessments. For those who wish to read the court’s opinion in its entirely, you may download the PDF file at:

http://www.courts.ca.gov/opinions/documents/S202107.PDF

This particular case revolved around a negligent vehicular homicide charge. However, the ruling has serious implications for every citizen, especially those of us who carry, because in “California v. Richard Tom” (08/14/2014), the court has essentially turned the Fifth Amendment on its head.

Most Americans are aware that it is the Fifth Amendment to the Constitution that protects our right to not speak when taken into custody, if to do so might incriminate us. The Miranda decision (1966) merely resulted in the now familiar warning to a potential defendant that the right exists. California v. Tom affirmed this:

“Accordingly, a suspect’s silence after being arrested gives rise to a much stronger inference of reliance on the Fifth Amendment privilege than a witness’s noncustodial silence even ‘in the face of official suspicions.’”

But remember that you also have the right to remain silent before being placed in custody. However, note that this applies (prior to arrest and/or a Miranda warning) only if you have invoked your rights:

“In order to trigger the Fifth Amendment’s protection, the court today holds, a suspect in custody may not simply remain silent. Instead, the suspect must ‘clearly,’ ‘timely,’ and ‘unambiguously’ invoke the Fifth Amendment privilege.”

Since he did not invoke his Fifth Amendment rights, in court Richard Tom was attacked for what he did not say (specifically, he never asked about the condition of the injured people in the other vehicle). The court upheld the right of the prosecution to use this against him.

This is dangerous ground. For if both speaking and not speaking can be used against us, then we are in a “damned if we do; damned if we don’t” scenario. As veteran criminal defense attorney and former criminal prosecutor David Gross puts it:

“In other words, he must now speak in order not to incriminate himself, and that amounts to compulsory self-incrimination by silence. This is really scary.”

While this ruling occurred in California, we have seen how bad ideas from the “Left Coast” often wind up spreading across the country. So it probably won’t be long before some prosecutor in your state attempts to reference this decision as justification for inferring “guilt by silence” in a self-defense case.

What this all means in plain English is that it’s absolutely vital that after any lethal confrontation, you immediately invoke your Fifth Amendment rights, even before you have been placed in custody. If you do, you’ll be better able to justify your silence later.

Consult your attorney on recommended wording, but in my carry classes, per my attorney friends’ instructions, I suggest a concise “script” to use the moment police arrive. “Officer, thank God you’re here. He (they) tried to kill me. I don’t want to say anything more until my attorney is with me.” Then, keep your mouth shut until your lawyer arrives.

Courts are constantly modifying and reinterpreting law, including the Constitution. As a result, understanding your rights is more important than ever.
https://www.usconcealedcarry.com/dis...MzgwMzM3NjA0S0
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Old 06-15-2015, 03:26 PM   #42
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I haven't been keeping up with adding the email(s) I receive to this thread, but figured this video they have recently published is a good one to share. It discusses some of the changes with open carry, campus carry, and 30.07 (30.06 for OC) signage. He also mentions that violation of 30.06 has been reduced to a class C Mr. Meaner (as well as the new 30.07). That said, refusing to leave with verbal notice is still class A.

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Old 06-15-2015, 05:53 PM   #43
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Damn man, I Just took the class saturday, and TLS came in and did a little sell bit. Man, I'm really thinking about purchasing this actually. I'm excited to read this thread.
I was actually going to post about this here this week.
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Old 06-15-2015, 05:58 PM   #44
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They are very helpfull. Back in June I shot some one that broke into my shed and we called the number on the card and they walk me through the whole thing. As of today's date the lawyer calls me just to see whats going on with the case.
Does anyone know what came of this?
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Old 06-15-2015, 06:14 PM   #45
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30.07 (30.06 for OC) signage.
just being picky, but thats a typo 30.07 is OC and 30.06 is CC
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Old 06-15-2015, 07:40 PM   #46
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just being picky, but thats a typo 30.07 is OC and 30.06 is CC
I worded it poorly. My meaning was that 30.07 was equivalent to 30.06, but for OC.
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Old 06-15-2015, 09:20 PM   #47
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Well this was the first time ever shooting some one and felt like shit the whole day thinking I might get in trouble. The guy was shot 3 times. 1 in the arm, 1 in the chest and 1 in the leg. It was all over the news. He was in critical condition all that day and news cast and police didnt think he was going to make it. I shout him with a xds 45 and as if today they still have my weapon.
Somehow I missed your post. Did the guy live? If so, where is he now? Hopefully in jail or only recently released.

Also it should be a crime and they need to have to face charges if they take your gun. Either that, or they have to provide you with a backup if you say its your only gun, and they've only got 1 week to borrow yours or they have to buy you a brand new one. And if non of this is complied with, someone goes to jail at the end of that week. Need to put the pressure on these assholes.
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Old 06-15-2015, 10:10 PM   #48
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Somehow I missed your post. Did the guy live? If so, where is he now? Hopefully in jail or only recently released.

Also it should be a crime and they need to have to face charges if they take your gun. Either that, or they have to provide you with a backup if you say its your only gun, and they've only got 1 week to borrow yours or they have to buy you a brand new one. And if non of this is complied with, someone goes to jail at the end of that week. Need to put the pressure on these assholes.
I agree with you there, it is complete bullshit the police can just confiscate your gun and never give it back because it was legally used.
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Old 06-16-2015, 04:21 AM   #49
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I agree with you there, it is complete bullshit the police can just confiscate your gun and never give it back because it was legally used.
I've thought about this scenario before, you know the POS's are going to want it. Might do to hand it over to a neighbor or a buddy before they get the chance. Or though some means, make it inaccessible to them. Its not theirs, and they've got no business with it anyway. They've been told what happened, and its all pretty plain to see and was a clean legal shoot. Pound sand if you want my gun. Hell I'd probably just hide it and tell them that.

You might just put it back in your gun safe which is bolted to the floor, and when they ask for it, simply tell them no. Its not like they're going to cut open the safe to get it.
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Old 06-16-2015, 05:07 AM   #50
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Loosing a $500-$1,000 pistol to the legal system should be the absolute least of your worries if you have to use deadly force.
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Old 06-16-2015, 10:07 AM   #51
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Loosing a $500-$1,000 pistol to the legal system should be the absolute least of your worries if you have to use deadly force.
This is why I always buy a cheapo for just around the house...Maverick 88 comes to mind.
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Old 06-16-2015, 10:39 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by kbscobravert View Post
Loosing a $500-$1,000 pistol to the legal system should be the absolute least of your worries if you have to use deadly force.
This, for sure.

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This is why I always buy a cheapo for just around the house...Maverick 88 comes to mind.
So the gun you depend on most is a cheapo? Kidding. I have an XD and Mossburg 500 for home defense.. Nothing too expensive or fancy.

Seriously though, it sucks that they confiscate the weapon, and IMO, if you have already acknowledged you shot, and that was the weapon you used, why would they need it for evidence?

I do think it's kind of silly to expect the PD to provide a loaner though. That would be something I would ask a friend for, if I couldn't afford to buy something in the interim.
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Old 06-16-2015, 10:43 AM   #53
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This, for sure.



So the gun you depend on most is a cheapo? Kidding. I have an XD and Mossburg 500 for home defense.. Nothing too expensive or fancy.

Seriously though, it sucks that they confiscate the weapon, and IMO, if you have already acknowledged you shot, and that was the weapon you used, why would they need it for evidence?

I do think it's kind of silly to expect the PD to provide a loaner though. That would be something I would ask a friend for, if I couldn't afford to buy something in the interim.
You would likely be prevented from buying one from a dealer until it was cleared up in two years because you could be found guilty of a felony.
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Old 06-16-2015, 10:46 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by kbscobravert View Post
Loosing a $500-$1,000 pistol to the legal system should be the absolute least of your worries if you have to use deadly force.
Agreed.

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This is why I always buy a cheapo for just around the house...Maverick 88 comes to mind.
Cheap and reliable don't always go hand in hand though.
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Old 06-16-2015, 10:47 AM   #55
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You would likely be prevented from buying one from a dealer until it was cleared up in two years because you could be found guilty of a felony.
Good point. Then I am glad I have more than one firearm for home protection, or, as I said, I would look to borrow one from a friend.
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Old 06-16-2015, 10:48 AM   #56
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Cheap and reliable don't always go hand in hand though.
I think if there was an argument around this point - it would be with pump shotguns. Some of them just keep on working and don't fail as long as your arm is not broken.
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Old 06-16-2015, 10:58 AM   #57
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I think if there was an argument around this point - it would be with pump shotguns. Some of them just keep on working and don't fail as long as your arm is not broken.
True. Same could probably be said for revolvers. But honestly, I try not buy cheap guns which is probably why I don't have that many (not that what I have is ultra expensive). I think the cheapest thing I own for home defense is a Taurus Model 85. And I keep that more for sentimental reasons and it wouldn't be my go to gun for defending my life.
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Old 06-16-2015, 09:46 PM   #58
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Loosing a $500-$1,000 pistol to the legal system should be the absolute least of your worries if you have to use deadly force.
In reality, it probably would be, after I just shot someone. But there is still the principle of the thing. I shot someone because I didn't feel like I wanted to be robbed, and now the "law" just gets to come around and do it legally? Hell why didn't I just help the thief carry the stuff out of my house and load it up in his pickup? Fuck them, they have no right or any business with the gun. What exactly, do they need it for? We all know they are looking for any excuse they can to take guns away from people, and it may be legal for you to tell them to get bent, I don't know.
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Old 06-19-2015, 09:27 AM   #59
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Took my CHL class last night and signed up with Texas Law Shield while I was there.

The Garland attack prompted me to get off my procrastinating ass.
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Old 06-19-2015, 11:51 AM   #60
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Now you just got to actually carry. I never do. Just wanted the option. Its a pain because too many places wail like an infant if you have one. If I start carrying, its going to be fuck them all unless they're courthouses or some such. I can't be bothered, and don't have time arm up, then disarm, then arm, then disarm, over and over and over just because I got out of the truck somewhere that is run by bleeding vaginas. All the while worrying whether some unworthy liberal piece of filth is going to spy your piece while you move it around. And call the police, and then because they're generally a bunch low IQ'ers, they harass you.

Besides we all know that rather than face death in one of these full retard establishments, we'd all much rather just shoot the prick, and face the consequences for having a gun in the building.

They do not make this easy. They make something very simple, very difficult.
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