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Old 05-15-2011, 02:40 PM   #41
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U defend him who use's racial slurs like hes drinking water.
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Old 05-15-2011, 02:49 PM   #42
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Yes, it is a case of "tail-chasing".
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Old 05-15-2011, 03:12 PM   #43
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I'm not saying science is "wrong". I'm saying it wasn't science alone. Who gave us "science"? Evolution as a theory alone, just doesn't work. There's theories abound about what killed off dinosaurs. They ALL have scientific backing. Guys spend more time trying to dis-prove things than they do to prove their own point. You can't prove a negative. If you're closed minded enough to shut out creationism, why would smoke-and-mirrors science work, if you can't prove it? It amazes me that there are egomaniacs around that think we humans are "it". We're just not that great.

The Theory of Evolution has tons of holes in it.
What holes are you talking about, specifically. Evolution, as a theory alone, does work. How do you explain how you got here. Take the flu shot for example, it's WHOLLY based on evolution, how the flu virus will evolve from one year to the next. If that doesn't work. Look up the Lenski experiments. If you'd like I can post up the study, and for easier understanding a youtube video.

What gave us science? Not accepting what religion was saying, testing thoughts, putting them under scrutiny.

I don't have to prove a negative unless the positive has been proven. The reason I've shut out creationism is because there is NO factual evidence in support of it. When some is shown I'll give it another look.

What do you mean by "it?" I equate humans as just another animal, like monkeys, dogs, cats. We are no more special than any other animal on the face of the planet. The reason we're at the top of the food chain is because our thinking abilities. If it weren't for that, we'd be fodder for a myriad of other species of animal out there. We aren't strong, we don't have claws or fangs in the typical sense. The only advantage we've got is our minds.
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Old 05-15-2011, 03:18 PM   #44
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What holes are you talking about, specifically. Evolution, as a theory alone, does work. How do you explain how you got here. Take the flu shot for example, it's WHOLLY based on evolution, how the flu virus will evolve from one year to the next. If that doesn't work. Look up the Lenski experiments. If you'd like I can post up the study, and for easier understanding a youtube video.

What gave us science? Not accepting what religion was saying, testing thoughts, putting them under scrutiny.

I don't have to prove a negative unless the positive has been proven. The reason I've shut out creationism is because there is NO factual evidence in support of it. When some is shown I'll give it another look.

What do you mean by "it?" I equate humans as just another animal, like monkeys, dogs, cats. We are no more special than any other animal on the face of the planet. The reason we're at the top of the food chain is because our thinking abilities. If it weren't for that, we'd be fodder for a myriad of other species of animal out there. We aren't strong, we don't have claws or fangs in the typical sense. The only advantage we've got is our minds.
Dinosaurs were here for about 230 million years and didn't evolve worth shit. Man's been here 1 percent of that, and we started as apes. GTFO with that! How come cro-magnon isn't still walking around? Armadillo's are. Crocodiles are. How come they haven't evolved? Why do we still have cancer? Evolution should have taken care of that when it got rid of the use for our appendix. There are a SHIT TON of problems with evolution, hence it is a "theory". Is there evolution? Yeah. Is that the answer to everything that's on this earth and in the galaxies? Not hardly.

Where did that ameoba come from anyway?

Last edited by Vertnut; 05-15-2011 at 03:26 PM.
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Old 05-15-2011, 04:26 PM   #45
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Dinosaurs were here for about 230 million years and didn't evolve worth shit.
Just because "they didn't evolve worth shit" doesn't mean they didn't evolve
Man's been here 1 percent of that, and we started as apes. GTFO with that!
can you not comprehend that we're a great ape, all decendants of Plesiadapiform, dated to 56 million years ago, less than 10 million years after dinosaurs went extinct.
How come cro-magnon isn't still walking around?
Because they evolved into Homo Sapien. Sometime in the future Homo Sapien will cease to exist, and there will be another species that has descended from it.
Armadillo's are.
Xenarthra (sloths, anteaters, and armadillos) formed around 50 million years ago
Crocodiles are. How come they haven't evolved?
They have. See: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...le-brazil.html

Why do we still have cancer?
Biology isn't perfect. Why do we have autism, or any other genetic disease. Sometimes shit just goes wrong.
Evolution should have taken care of that when it got rid of the use for our appendix.
Evolution didn't get rid of the use for our appendix, we did, with our improved hygene. Current theory says that the appendix is a "safe haven" for good bacteria in the event of sickness.

There are a SHIT TON of problems with evolution, hence it is a "theory". Is there evolution? Yeah. Is that the answer to everything that's on this earth and in the galaxies? Not hardly.

Where did that ameoba come from anyway?
You confuse abiogenesis and evolution. Evolution doesn't touch on how life began. Before life you had abiogenesis, once life began the age of abiogenesis ended and the age of evolution began.

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Is there evolution? Yeah.
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Originally Posted by Vertnut
Evolution as a theory alone, just doesn't work.
Do what? Something is what it is, isn't what it is not. And can't be both or neither at the same time. So which is it, either evolution is true, or it is not.

Explain to me why you're arguing that evolution has holes in it? Science, more specifically evolution in this case make no claim to know the answer to everything. If it knew everything, it would stop. I'm merely pointing out where you're wrong in your thought processes.
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Old 05-15-2011, 04:41 PM   #46
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You confuse abiogenesis and evolution. Evolution doesn't touch on how life began. Before life you had abiogenesis, once life began the age of abiogenesis ended and the age of evolution began.



Do what? Something is what it is, isn't what it is not. And can't be both or neither at the same time. So which is it, either evolution is true, or it is not.

Explain to me why you're arguing that evolution has holes in it? Science, more specifically evolution in this case make no claim to know the answer to everything. If it knew everything, it would stop. I'm merely pointing out where you're wrong in your thought processes.
You're not pointing out I'm wrong. You have selective reading comprehension. You're arguing semantics. I said there is "evolution", but not ONLY evolution. There's way too many authors with idea's about why evolution can't explain a lot of the animal life we have. The human eye, the cardio system of the giraffe (Darwin's explanation is laughable, admitted by several scientists'), and a lot of other "oddities" in nature, cannot be explained by evolution. So they come up with the "genetic defect" crap. So anything that science doesn't cover, is a "genetic defect" or "mutation". Hell, you can use that silly excuse for anything, but for a supposed "science"? This thread was a pretty limp attempt to appear casual about this debate. It's a matter of faith either way. I have faith that a creator started this ball rolling, and you have faith that we crawled out of a genetic slime bucket. I love the "used to be a christian" dookie, too. It's a nice touch and really sets the tone.
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Old 05-15-2011, 04:53 PM   #47
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You're not pointing out I'm wrong. You have selective reading comprehension. You're arguing semantics. I said there is "evolution", but not ONLY evolution. There's way too many authors with idea's about why evolution can't explain a lot of the animal life we have. The human eye, the cardio system of the giraffe (Darwin's explanation is laughable, admitted by several scientists'), and a lot of other "oddities" in nature, cannot be explained by evolution. So they come up with the "genetic defect" crap. So anything that science doesn't cover, is a "genetic defect" or "mutation". Hell, you can use that silly excuse for anything, but for a supposed "science"? This thread was a pretty limp attempt to appear casual about this debate. It's a matter of faith either way. I have faith that a creator started this ball rolling, and you have faith that we crawled out of a genetic slime bucket. I love the "used to be a christian" dookie, too. It's a nice touch and really sets the tone.
You said there were holes in evolution. Evolution doesn't touch on how the processes work, only how they change. You should read up on the theory of evolution so you don't get misconstrued as to what exactly evolution is about. In your statements against science or evolution, you need to be more specific so the points of contention can be addressed.

Anything that science doesn't cover it says "I don't know" And immediately the religious people chime in with the "Well science doesn't know, so god done it."

How many times do I have to tell people, I place no faith in anything. I don't place faith that I
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Originally Posted by Vertnut
crawled out of a genetic slime bucket
because life is here, provable, observable, measurable. Unlike your creator. Who, in his current definition cannot be proven, observed, or measured. Everything that exists can have those three things done to it. Since your creator cannot be proven, measured, or observed, he must not exist.
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Old 05-15-2011, 05:28 PM   #48
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If your understanding of scientific terminology, as evidenced by the quoted post, is any indication of your intelligence, you're severely lacking. You seem to think a theory is an idea (actual: hypothesis) when in fact theories have been tested and proven.
I know i said i was done, but i think you need to get your fats straight before telling other people they dont know shit.

see #2 as quoted from dictionary.com:
the·o·ry
   /ˈθiəri, ˈθɪəri/ Show Spelled[thee-uh-ree, theer-ee] Show IPA
–noun, plural -ries.
1.
a coherent group of general propositions used as principles of explanation for a class of phenomena: Einstein's theory of relativity.
2.
a proposed explanation whose status is still conjectural, in contrast to well-established propositions that are regarded as reporting matters of actual fact.

3.
Mathematics . a body of principles, theorems, or the like, belonging to one subject: number theory.



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Hard to argue when you don't have a leg to stand on, isn't it?
you got me good.....
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Old 05-15-2011, 05:29 PM   #49
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You just have to accept the fact that not everybody is going to see eye to eye on religion just like other beliefs and leave it alone. If you think you're going to "open somebody's eyes" you're wrong.
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Old 05-15-2011, 05:41 PM   #50
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I know i said i was done, but i think you need to get your fats straight before telling other people they dont know shit.

see #2 as quoted from dictionary.com:
the·o·ry
   /ˈθiəri, ˈθɪəri/ Show Spelled[thee-uh-ree, theer-ee] Show IPA
–noun, plural -ries.
1.
a coherent group of general propositions used as principles of explanation for a class of phenomena: Einstein's theory of relativity.
2.
a proposed explanation whose status is still conjectural, in contrast to well-established propositions that are regarded as reporting matters of actual fact.

3.
Mathematics . a body of principles, theorems, or the like, belonging to one subject: number theory.





you got me good.....
I did get you good. I said scientific terminology, not layperson terminology. If we were talking about just random stuff, and not science, I'd agree with you, a theory is an idea. Since we're talking about science, you are wrong. http://chemistry.about.com/od/chemis.../lawtheory.htm

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Originally Posted by Anne Marie Helmenstine, Ph.D.
Theory

A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing. A theory is valid as long as there is no evidence to dispute it. Therefore, theories can be disproven. Basically, if evidence accumulates to support a hypothesis, then the hypothesis can become accepted as a good explanation of a phenomenon. One definition of a theory is to say it's an accepted hypothesis.

Example: It is known that on June 30, 1908 in Tunguska, Siberia, there was an explosion equivalent to the detonation of about 15 million tons of TNT. Many hypotheses have been proposed for what caused the explosion. It is theorized that the explosion was caused by a natural extraterrestrial phenomenon, and was not caused by man. Is this theory a fact? No. The event is a recorded fact. Is this this theory generally accepted to be true, based on evidence to-date? Yes. Can this theory be shown to be false and be discarded? Yes.
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Old 05-15-2011, 05:57 PM   #51
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You said there were holes in evolution. Evolution doesn't touch on how the processes work, only how they change. You should read up on the theory of evolution so you don't get misconstrued as to what exactly evolution is about. In your statements against science or evolution, you need to be more specific so the points of contention can be addressed.

Anything that science doesn't cover it says "I don't know" And immediately the religious people chime in with the "Well science doesn't know, so god done it."

How many times do I have to tell people, I place no faith in anything. I don't place faith that I because life is here, provable, observable, measurable. Unlike your creator. Who, in his current definition cannot be proven, observed, or measured. Everything that exists can have those three things done to it. Since your creator cannot be proven, measured, or observed, he must not exist.
I can tell you're over your head when you become patronizing. You've answered none of the questions I posed, which is safe!
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Old 05-15-2011, 06:07 PM   #52
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You just have to accept the fact that not everybody is going to see eye to eye on religion just like other beliefs and leave it alone. If you think you're going to "open somebody's eyes" you're wrong.
I totally agree. He started this thread under the guise that he needed someone to convince him about the validity of the bible. That he was once silly enough to be a "believer", but had since seen the error of his ways...lol.
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Old 05-15-2011, 06:20 PM   #53
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I can tell you're over your head when you become patronizing. You've answered none of the questions I posed, which is safe!
It's funny you say that. I posted this thread with a question, which STILL hasn't been answered.

I've answered all your questions to the best of my ability. When you've asked questions and not made rhetorical statements, that is. Unless I've missed a question, I've handled all of them. If I haven't responded to a question, feel free to ask again and I will respond to the best of my ability
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Old 05-15-2011, 07:18 PM   #54
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It's funny you say that. I posted this thread with a question, which STILL hasn't been answered.

I've answered all your questions to the best of my ability. When you've asked questions and not made rhetorical statements, that is. Unless I've missed a question, I've handled all of them. If I haven't responded to a question, feel free to ask again and I will respond to the best of my ability
I was going to PM you, but i think this is more appropriate here. I'm sorry iv'e been an ass to you. Been a rough few days. Anyways if you're ever in town, id like to buy you a beer. Ask Yale, i'm a pretty easy going dude. I still think i'm smarter though ..... (even though math is more of my strong suit than science lol)

And don't take my apology as me agreeing with you either lol.
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Old 05-15-2011, 07:31 PM   #55
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I was going to PM you, but i think this is more appropriate here. I'm sorry iv'e been an ass to you. Been a rough few days. Anyways if you're ever in town, id like to buy you a beer. Ask Yale, i'm a pretty easy going dude. I still think i'm smarter though ..... (even though math is more of my strong suit than science lol)

And don't take my apology as me agreeing with you either lol.
No hard feelings. He told me you were pretty cool. I wouldn't take your apology any other way. Hell, some of my friends are theists, and we get along great. My offer still stands to everyone else in this thread about the beer/burger&soda (except The King, that guy is a fucking moron.)

I don't know when we'll be back in town. But rest assured, there will be a party when we do.

I don't think I've come across as a dick any, but if I did I apologize. It hasn't been a rough few days, but a lot of time to myself usually makes me a bit dickish, lol.
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Old 05-15-2011, 07:32 PM   #56
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It's funny you say that. I posted this thread with a question, which STILL hasn't been answered.
I believe there was pretty good evidence in post #15...
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Old 05-15-2011, 07:34 PM   #57
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No hard feelings. He told me you were pretty cool. I wouldn't take your apology any other way. Hell, some of my friends are theists, and we get along great. My offer still stands to everyone else in this thread about the beer/burger&soda (except The King, that guy is a fucking moron.)

I don't know when we'll be back in town. But rest assured, there will be a party when we do.

I don't think I've come across as a dick any, but if I did I apologize. It hasn't been a rough few days, but a lot of time to myself usually makes me a bit dickish, lol.
Cool. Look forward to meeting you. Yale has talked a bunch of shit about you, but i like to form my own opinions!
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Old 05-15-2011, 07:37 PM   #58
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Cool. Look forward to meeting you. Yale has talked a bunch of shit about you, but i like to form my own opinions!
Don't believe a word he says, even though most of it's true....
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Old 05-15-2011, 07:40 PM   #59
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I believe there was pretty good evidence in post #15...
FUCKING SERIOUSLY!? Look, you're about to journey down a huge path of circular reasoning. You're trying to use Jesus as proof the bible is true. When, to the best of my knowledge, there's no proof Jesus existed outside of the bible, let alone performed the "miracles" he did. You'd figure that if he did the things he did, someone, somewhere would write about it. Yet the only place it's found is in the bible.
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Old 05-15-2011, 07:53 PM   #60
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don't believe a word he says, even though most of it's true....
lol
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