A Western Big 3 Question

[CJ5]

The Hebrew, Christian, Islam that is,

Christianity has the Holy Ghost. Is there a comparable notion in the others?

If so, which takes precedence, Spirit or holy book? Is it the same for all three, or different?

[The King]

In the case of Christianity, and likely in the case of Judaism, since my belief is that the Holy Spirit facilitated the recording of the Word of God in the Bible, both Old and New Testaments, one need not hold precedence over the other.

I can't speak for Islam.

[lowthreeohz]

Judaism believes in the existence of a god, no more and no less.

[The King]

I wasn't sure about Judaism, and I included it primarily because of Genesis 1, verses 1-2

(KJV)
1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

Also in my opinion, much of the Old Testament prophecy could be attributed to the workings of the Holy Spirit.

[lowthreeohz]

I'm no theology major, but i don't think citing the KJV is particularly prudent when discussing Judaism.

[jdgregory84]

In the case of Christianity, and likely in the case of Judaism, since my belief is that the Holy Spirit facilitated the recording of the Word of God in the Bible, both Old and New Testaments, one need not hold precedence over the other.

I can't speak for Islam.

But you've told me numerous times that the Old Testament doesn't count because of Jesus.

[StangTamer]

Judaism's Torah is the same book as the Old Test. Christians use. The Holy Spirit is recognized in Judaism, Old & New Test., and Muslims believe in the Holy Spirit but they believe it is the Angel Gabriel, and that it is not divine.

Judaism, Islam, and Christianity all started out with the same God. Islam forked off with Abraham's son Ishmael and Judaism and Christianity forked off with Abraham's son Isaac. Judaism holds the belief that the Messiah has not come yet, hence no New Test. Christians believe Jesus is the Messiah hence, the Old and New Test.

The Father, Son(The Word) and Holy Spirit are one. Kind of like a human has three parts a spirit, soul and body. Or if you had water, ice, and steam it is the same, but different. 1x1x1=1 or length, width, height.


JD- I think what he was trying to tell you is... The Old Test. law is not counted to a born again Christian. Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law. We are no longer under the law, but under grace. Jesus paid for the sins of the whole world from yesterday, today and forever. Sin will no longer send anyone to hell. The only way someone goes to hell is by rejecting Jesus as their Savior and refusing the payment that has already been made. It is a free gift that can not be earned.

It would be like me telling someone I am giving them my brand new car and said, "here you go", and put the keys on the table in front of them and said, "just take the keys when you are ready", and instead of them picking up the keys and driving home in the car, they turn around and walk home. The car is theirs for the taking, but they have to receive the gift in order to reap the benefits. You would think someone would have to be an idiot not to pick up the keys.

The Gospel means "almost to good to be true". The one thing that set Christianity apart from all other religions is... All other religions are based on what they have to do to earn their gods love and to be accepted. It is strictly by their works alone. Christianity is the only religion that God loves you unconditionally, God already accepts you, and you can't get God to love you more than what he already does by doing good deeds, and you can't get God to love you any less by the sins you commit. God loves us so much that he will honor a persons decision to reject Him and go to hell. God won't force anyone to love him, because it wouldn't be love. We have to accept God, because our God has already accepted us. All of the other religions are man made(imo) because they are exactly made up the same way the world works. If you do good you are rewarded, but if you do bad you will be punished. That is a worldly system. But, if you look at Christianity you get grace(what you don't deserve) and mercy(you don't get what you deserve). We should all be sent to hell, but God loves us so much that he became the one thing he hates the most(sin) and carried our burdens, so we could be free from the bondage of sin and come back into relationship with him. Only a fool would deny a gift like that.

I understand people have turned away from the Christian faith because they have had problems with Christians/Christianity in the past for some reason or the other. But, it would be foolish to judge and reject God because someone that claims they are a Christian rubbed you the wrong way. Christians aren't perfect, just forgiven. There are a lot of wrong teachings by people who don't read their Bible and there are a lot of "religious" Christians that think God is lucky to have them on his side. People miss it and are going to fail you, saved or unsaved. But, God is always faithful and will never let you down. I don't look at other Christians to be my example. My example is Jesus. The cool thing about having free will is when you hear a church offends you or teaches falsely, you don't have to go there anymore!! If a Christian is a hypocrite a pisses you off, you don't have to hang out with them!! There are plenty of good churches and Christians out there, it just might take some effort on your behalf to find them.

[YALE]

The Old Testament's take on the Torah is a really narrow view of what Jews believe. They also have the Talmud, and other holy writings. Also, the KJV's version of the Torah is a child's explanations of it. "Don't pay too much attention here, we'll get to the important stuff in a bit."

[The King]

But you've told me numerous times that the Old Testament doesn't count because of Jesus.

Incorrect recollection on your part. I've told you numerous times that Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament laws on our behalf. That is in no way stating that the Old Testament or the laws therein don't count.

To quote Jesus own words:
Matthew 5:17-18 (KJV)
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

[The King]

I'm no theology major, but i don't think citing the KJV is particularly prudent when discussing Judaism.

My post was only a statement of my opinion anyway, so you may be correct. The version of the Bible matters not to me, only the message, and the KJV happens to be my favorite.

[jdgregory84]

Incorrect recollection on your part. I've told you numerous times that Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament laws on our behalf. That is in no way stating that the Old Testament or the laws therein don't count.

To quote Jesus own words:
Matthew 5:17-18 (KJV)
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

So since Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament we can ignore it, right? Even with your quote saying "you have to abide by these laws" Jesus took care of it. So if I want to sell my first born as long as it's a girl, into slavery, that's fine. Right? Or did Jesus fix that also?

[CJ5]

What is the law that has been or will be fulfilled?
Why must the law be fulfilled or why was such a structure set up that a law must be fulfilled?
What is the foundation of lacking that requires a fulfillment?

[The King]

What is the law that has been or will be fulfilled?

Law of Moses (Mosaic Law)

Why must the law be fulfilled or why was such a structure set up that a law must be fulfilled?

These were instructions from God to, among other things, provide a common means to enable mankind to subordinate his own will to God's Will.

What is the foundation of lacking that requires a fulfillment?

In my opinion, the original sin.