Ford getting ready to tell dealers to get ****

[svauto-erotic855]

That's amazing.

You should have seen the Ferrari market here in Dallas during the 80s. It was even crazier than what was just described.

[Craizie]

I built the car and it was a $98k MSRP build which is what I paid. This was for a sapphire blue 2016 981 GT4, not the new 718 GT4. I drove it 8,400 miles and sold it back through the dealer for $96k to another client and got the 2018 GT3 allocation. That was a $162k build, I drove it 3.5 years and put 13,000 dog miles on it (aka a lot of track, 9,000rpm, brake pads, tires, etc.) and sold it back to the dealer two months ago for $5k less than I paid.

Not a bad cost of ownership on those cars and I got lucky with the GT3 as it was probably a $140k car before the used car market got all messed up in my favor.

That's amazing.

[quikag]

If you don't mind sharing the information can you please tell us what you paid for the GT4? I had my heart set on one a while back but when I went to the dealer I discovered that I was one of about 50 people wanting the 4 cars that they were going to get and I wasn't willing to kiss their ring to get the car.

I built the car and it was a $98k MSRP build which is what I paid. This was for a sapphire blue 2016 981 GT4, not the new 718 GT4. I drove it 8,400 miles and sold it back through the dealer for $96k to another client and got the 2018 GT3 allocation. That was a $162k build, I drove it 3.5 years and put 13,000 dog miles on it (aka a lot of track, 9,000rpm, brake pads, tires, etc.) and sold it back to the dealer two months ago for $5k less than I paid.

Not a bad cost of ownership on those cars and I got lucky with the GT3 as it was probably a $140k car before the used car market got all messed up in my favor.

[Gasser64]

I just don't want to have to sit there talking to someone for longer than it takes to sign some papers.

We're still doing things the way they did it in ancient times. When dinosaurs were still around. Even at Carmax which has somewhat streamlined it, you still have to go sit in there and sign here, here, here here here here

Even when you don't need financing. They need to get it down to 10 minutes tops. Spending 20 min in a dealership is too much, I don't care about anything they have to say. In fact it ought to be all online and they just bring it to my house. A car with 3k miles on it is fine. It's got a factory warranty and even the stealerships little 30 day satisfaction warranty or whatever. It's fine. Don't waste my time.

Now if it's some old junk you gotta go look it over. But the shit most of us buy these days... nah. Bring it to my door and I don't wanna talk to you. Maybe I'm asocial, but also maybe I don't wanna hear you beg for more money.

[svauto-erotic855]

Agreed. The only car I've ever paid sticker for is a new Porsche GT4 and a GT3. Also, going to be paying sticker for my Blackwing. So, for high demand cars with ridiculous resale value, I'll pay sticker. Other cars I will argue over the remaining $50 after squeezing every drop of blood I think I can on discounts just to see if I got it all and I'm willing to do it over days or weeks to test their "desperation."

If you don't mind sharing the information can you please tell us what you paid for the GT4? I had my heart set on one a while back but when I went to the dealer I discovered that I was one of about 50 people wanting the 4 cars that they were going to get and I wasn't willing to kiss their ring to get the car.

[Rick Modena]

Other cars I will argue over the remaining $50 after squeezing every drop of blood I think I can on discounts just to see if I got it all and I'm willing to do it over days or weeks to test their "desperation."

lol!

[quikag]

This is a stealerships favorite customer, a dumbass with decent credit or a guy with a little money who doesn't care.


I'm the same way, I'm not paying MSRP for ANY car and never have. I know the markup and I ain't paying it. I worked too hard for my money to just blow it away.
Perfect example is my current 5.0, it was last years model, because of covid I had to wait for the '21's to start arriving to get a deal but I was in no hurry, so in February I pulled the trigger, I paid $43K and MSRP was $54k. I got a brand new car with all of the option I wanted and depending on whwho your trust as fars as miles go, I have 10k-15k free miles for a year, in theory of course.

Agreed. The only car I've ever paid sticker for is a new Porsche GT4 and a GT3. Also, going to be paying sticker for my Blackwing. So, for high demand cars with ridiculous resale value, I'll pay sticker. Other cars I will argue over the remaining $50 after squeezing every drop of blood I think I can on discounts just to see if I got it all and I'm willing to do it over days or weeks to test their "desperation."

[Rick Modena]

"What is the monthly on something like this?"

This is a stealerships favorite customer, a dumbass with decent credit or a guy with a little money who doesn't care.

but I do it because I'm a cheap bastard and I don't like wasting money.

I'm the same way, I'm not paying MSRP for ANY car and never have. I know the markup and I ain't paying it. I worked too hard for my money to just blow it away.
Perfect example is my current 5.0, it was last years model, because of covid I had to wait for the '21's to start arriving to get a deal but I was in no hurry, so in February I pulled the trigger, I paid $43K and MSRP was $54k. I got a brand new car with all of the option I wanted and depending on whwho your trust as fars as miles go, I have 10k-15k free miles for a year, in theory of course.

[quikag]

If they cut out the middle man and charge the same flat rate to everyone, what's the issue?

My "logic" and point is you aren't saving shit if you still make the deal with a sales guy. You just didn't pay as much as they were trying to rip off someone else for.

He's still making money and putting food on his table.

The issue is the current business model for most dealerships is to have an inflated price and the people who are knowledgeable, know how to negotiate, know how to research, and are willing to spend a little time will get a better deal than some shmuck that walks in off the street and starts drooling on the Dodge Challenger and asking, "What is the monthly on something like this?"

I would be totally fine with a flat price business model like what Tesla does because negotiating is not fun for me, but I do it because I'm a cheap bastard and I don't like wasting money.

[svauto-erotic855]

Exactly! All the more reason to negotiate. Because I know they marked it up to account for people that might negotiate. By your logic, you're ok with paying an already inflated price? It's not like we're talking a few hundred bucks...this could potentially save thousands depending on your negotiation tactics.

And yeah, it does suck spending a couple of weeks shopping and negotiating with different dealers, haggling, dangling carrots, etc, but why would anyone just willingly leave money on the table? I will pick as much meat off that bone as I can.

Like my daughter and SNL...they thought their purchase was a fair deal and I'm like FAIR?!?! Do you think that salesman went home and thought he gave a buyer a fair deal? No. He went home with a fat commission. I'm sure the salesman was a nice guy but I'm not trying to put food on his table. I'm by no means a dfwstangs baller so maybe that's the difference between you and me.

I don't need to save thousands even if it's $5,000 or $6,000 off of the price of a vehicle. I just don't want to have to sit there talking to someone for longer than it takes to sign some papers. If I can't get to the fair negotiated price in 10 minutes then I walk because I won't be the chump that overpaid either. Consequently I own a few million dollars worth of guns instead of spending the same money or little less on cars over the years.

Being forced by state law to purchase a vehicle from the dealership benefits absolutely no one except for the people that work at the dealership or own it. They bring nothing to the table.

[Trip McNeely]

I think online sites have helped tremendously in showing the value of used and new cars for the purpose of trade in for buying. I have used that information and gone in telling them what I want for my trade in and what their car is worth. If they want to dick me around for an hour that’s their time wasted. You can always walk away. In fact when you do you usually score the upper hand. That’s how my last few deals have gone for myself at least. So I could go with or without a dealership makes no difference to me. The internet is a powerful researching tool. The salesman has no bearing on me.

[Craizie]

Exactly! All the more reason to negotiate. Because I know they marked it up to account for people that might negotiate. By your logic, you're ok with paying an already inflated price? It's not like we're talking a few hundred bucks...this could potentially save thousands depending on your negotiation tactics.

And yeah, it does suck spending a couple of weeks shopping and negotiating with different dealers, haggling, dangling carrots, etc, but why would anyone just willingly leave money on the table? I will pick as much meat off that bone as I can.

Like my daughter and SNL...they thought their purchase was a fair deal and I'm like FAIR?!?! Do you think that salesman went home and thought he gave a buyer a fair deal? No. He went home with a fat commission. I'm sure the salesman was a nice guy but I'm not trying to put food on his table. I'm by no means a dfwstangs baller so maybe that's the difference between you and me.

If they cut out the middle man and charge the same flat rate to everyone, what's the issue?

My "logic" and point is you aren't saving shit if you still make the deal with a sales guy. You just didn't pay as much as they were trying to rip off someone else for.

He's still making money and putting food on his table.

[Rick Modena]

Going to a stealership sucks, its a gigantic waste of time. I used to like going in and playing the game and knowing what they actually paid for the car and getting as close to that as possible.
As I got older and my time became more valuable and indispensable, ain't nobody got time for that shit! In and around circa 1998 I was friends with a GM of Bankston Ford (Autonation now) and got the entire scoop on how to buy a new car from a stealership, of course always around the end of the month and if you can wait the end of the year when by now the new model years are pouring in and they have to liquidate the previous year model.
I have scored most all of my new cars in this way and have always gotten a great deal.
I've been buying new since 1994, the last several years I hardly even go in the stealership, until it's time to buy, I know what I want and research it before hand, I don't need to test drive, you should know what your buying and the Dallas Auto show or SFoT have their respective new car shows and you can get size, creature comforts, colors and options without too much annoyance by greedy ass salesman...

[GeorgeG.]

You sound old as fuck. Every generation thinks the following generation is a bunch of pussies because they don't put up with the same time wasting bullshit.

Maybe people value their Saturday off more than spending it with some cock sucker at a dealership trying to save a few bucks.

Anything you *think* you're saving by negotiating at a dealer was marked up above what the sales price should have been anyways.

Exactly! All the more reason to negotiate. Because I know they marked it up to account for people that might negotiate. By your logic, you're ok with paying an already inflated price? It's not like we're talking a few hundred bucks...this could potentially save thousands depending on your negotiation tactics.

And yeah, it does suck spending a couple of weeks shopping and negotiating with different dealers, haggling, dangling carrots, etc, but why would anyone just willingly leave money on the table? I will pick as much meat off that bone as I can.

Like my daughter and SNL...they thought their purchase was a fair deal and I'm like FAIR?!?! Do you think that salesman went home and thought he gave a buyer a fair deal? No. He went home with a fat commission. I'm sure the salesman was a nice guy but I'm not trying to put food on his table. I'm by no means a dfwstangs baller so maybe that's the difference between you and me.

[svauto-erotic855]

Let me say something that illustrates how much hatred I have for car dealerships. Out of all my trucks the oldest piece of shit that I own is a 2003 Dakota and that's the one I drive to work everyday. It's not like I haven't tried to buy some Tacomas but I've been to four different dealerships in the Metroplex and I've been trying to buy the trucks that I want since last October. Every single dealer lies to me when I call and ask if they have a particular truck and then when I show up to buy that truck they don't have it and then they try to get me to buy whatever they have on the lot. I tell them I'm not interested and tell them that I'm there to buy five new trucks and I would like to order them the way I want them. Not a single Toyota dealership has been willing to do that. Driving worn out trucks with half a million miles on them got so bad I told my guys to go buy whatever truck they wanted and I would pay $500 per month cash on the side towards their payments if they used it as their work truck.

A lot of my relatives are Ford employees or Ford retirees so I get Fords through the A plan or Z plan; I do not remember which. When I get on Ford's website and try to spec out an F-150 that I like that is a two-door base model with rubber floor mats the sticker on them is over $44,000 and I'm simply not going to pay that for what I consider to be a rolling tool box that is a dramatically lower quality than the Toyotas that I really want.