AR Vs. AK

[AnthonyS]

I actually had an NEC not an MOS. It was 3366 but the specific position I held is one about 100 or so guys can do at any time. You basically have one guy per sub with this job.

I got sucked into another field while on shore duty right after 9/11 though where I spent way too much time with small arms and marines due to needs of the navy.

It's also why I won't join and didn't join the reserves. I didn't want to go to the middle east. I'm happy for every soldier that makes it back from that cess pool.

[scottsmach03]

Do you honestly think that an AK barrel would be rock solid and straight after 7-8 magazines?

Man, thats a good point. I dont know. Is there a test out there? I havent come across one(not saying there isnt).

This m4 test was somewhat recent, thats why it is fresh in my mind.

Reason I posted was military was/is having some issues with their current M4's which caused Colt to provide thicker barrels.

[scottsmach03]

Either you dont understand combat and rifle mechanics enough to see why your argument is garbage, or you don't have anything better to show.

I like how you start with the personal attacks on my character, ive been shooting guns longer then most of the people on this board. Both my folks were military/leos. Seeing ar's, 92f's laying around the house was no big deal growing up. First gun i shot was a marlin 22(which i still have) at the age of 5. Im 32 now. I ve built ar's(upper and lowers) and sold them, been doing it for years. Before people got in on the ar craze.. Ive built guns, ive reloaded. Ive done most aspects of this hobbie i love. I respect your opinion, but you dont know me, and i dont know you.

[Moose242]

Troops apparently achieved what Colt is testing. In 2008 during a firefight they had more then one rifle "overheat". Which caused great concern, enough for the Military to bring it up. Now colt is revising their rifle.

Another quote from the article " After several magazines, the barrel smolders. Then it becomes red hot", what would the number value be on "several"? It doesnt blow up until 1:51 into the video. But starts to droop after 1:20 mark. I counted 11 mags before the 1:20 mark. It smolders before the 1:20 mark as stated in the article.

Do you honestly think that an AK barrel would be rock solid and straight after 7-8 magazines?

[scottsmach03]

I like how you completely abandoned your stress test argument and failed to post why that test you referenced is impossible for a troop to achieve. A light barrel will overheat, its common knowledge. If the AK had as high a cyclic rate as an AR, it would suffer even worse. And thats completely ignoring the weight difference.

Troops apparently achieved what Colt is testing. In 2008 during a firefight they had more then one rifle "overheat". Which caused great concern, enough for the Military to bring it up. Now colt is revising their rifle.

Another quote from the article " After several magazines, the barrel smolders. Then it becomes red hot", what would the number value be on "several"? It doesnt blow up until 1:51 into the video. But starts to droop after 1:20 mark. I counted 11 mags before the 1:20 mark. It smolders before the 1:20 mark as stated in the article.

[CJ]

Im not here to get caught up in a e-debate with ya'll. I should have looked up the article before posting and got my mag count correct before posting.

535 rounds in my opinion is not allot of rounds to go through before a firearm blows up because the barrel bends from heat.

Granted the cases are rare, but something did go down in 2008 for colt to revise their rifle.

Either you dont understand combat and rifle mechanics enough to see why your argument is garbage, or you don't have anything better to show.

[CJ]

"The M-4 carbine, one of the primary rifles used by the United States military, appears destined for a change. After concerns surfaced about rifles overheating in a sustained firefight in 2008 in Afghanistan, the manufacturer and the United States Army are close to agreeing on a modification to the weapon’s barrel that makes the carbine more resistant to the stresses of extended firing."

Apparently there was a firefight in 2008 in which something happened to cause concern. Fact....

I like how you completely abandoned your stress test argument and failed to post why that test you referenced is impossible for a troop to achieve. A light barrel will overheat, its common knowledge. If the AK had as high a cyclic rate as an AR, it would suffer even worse. And thats completely ignoring the weight difference.

[scottsmach03]

Im not here to get caught up in a e-debate with ya'll. I should have looked up the article before posting and got my mag count correct before posting.

535 rounds in my opinion is not allot of rounds to go through before a firearm blows up because the barrel bends from heat.

Granted the cases are rare, but something did go down in 2008 for colt to revise their rifle.

[scottsmach03]

In 2 minutes. This argument is garbage. 18 mag dumps... on a full auto rifle no troop has.

"The M-4 carbine, one of the primary rifles used by the United States military, appears destined for a change. After concerns surfaced about rifles overheating in a sustained firefight in 2008 in Afghanistan, the manufacturer and the United States Army are close to agreeing on a modification to the weapon’s barrel that makes the carbine more resistant to the stresses of extended firing."

Apparently there was a firefight in 2008 in which something happened to cause concern. Fact....

[CJ]

Ok, you got me there, was a couple of months ago when a read it so my number was off. So , after 535 rounds the barrel ruptures. Great.

In 2 minutes. This argument is garbage. 18 mag dumps... on a full auto rifle no troop has.

[CJ]

Allot of irony in this post ^

"It still doesn't change the fact that the greatest battlefield rifle of all time ( the AK ) is a pretty lousy personal survival weapon."

What do you do on a battlefield? You do your best to kill the oppisiton and survive. Which makes the AK a battlefield/survival rifle.

Ask any current soldier/marine in the service now that has done a few tours in the sand, and ask them how often their m16/m4's jam.

M16/m4 require constant attention before and after gun fights in order to keep operating.

Look up colts test on its current military rifle and you will notice they had to go to a heavier barrel due to the current barrel getting too hot and causing it to warp.
They ran 5 30rd mag's threw it and video'd the barrel bending after constant fire.

Seems military was complaining of rifle's exploding during firefights.

There are so many things wrong with this post. It's all hearsay and opinion with 1 fact which is wrong as hell.

[scottsmach03]

Apparently it is a problem considering they're doing tests and colt is swapping out old rifles for the new thicker barrel rifles.

[scottsmach03]

Just looked it up, you are wrong.

http://atwar.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/01/12/m4-and-m4a1-guns/

"...After the 535th round, when the barrel ruptures."

"It is worth noting that the test simulates conditions that almost no soldier could face. In it, 18 magazines are fed through the rifle in less than two minutes. Soldiers and Marines armed with an M-4 or M-16 (the carbine’s longer-barreled parent) typically carry seven or so magazines."


Hell of a lot more than "5 30 round mags" eh?

Ok, you got me there, was a couple of months ago when a read it so my number was off. So , after 535 rounds the barrel ruptures. Great.

[Moose242]

Ask any current soldier/marine in the service now that has done a few tours in the sand, and ask them how often their m16/m4's jam.

M16/m4 require constant attention before and after gun fights in order to keep operating.

Look up colts test on its current military rifle and you will notice they had to go to a heavier barrel due to the current barrel getting too hot and causing it to warp.
They ran 5 30rd mag's threw it and video'd the barrel bending after constant fire.

Seems military was complaining of rifle's exploding during firefights.

Just looked it up, you are wrong.

http://atwar.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/01/12/m4-and-m4a1-guns/

"...After the 535th round, when the barrel ruptures."

"It is worth noting that the test simulates conditions that almost no soldier could face. In it, 18 magazines are fed through the rifle in less than two minutes. Soldiers and Marines armed with an M-4 or M-16 (the carbine’s longer-barreled parent) typically carry seven or so magazines."


Hell of a lot more than "5 30 round mags" eh?

[scottsmach03]

And you perfectly fall for the bait and resort to the same crap Trublu is falling for.

It's really easy to call someone names on the Internet especially if you can't counter their argument.

Heck I may be a douche nozzle but you an Obama cum gurgler since clearly you attended the same school of logic he did.

Easy huh? We could do this forever too.

It still doesn't change the fact that the greatest battlefield rifle of all time ( the AK ) is a pretty lousy personal survival weapon.

If stopping power is your chief argument you can get larger caliber AR uppers quite easily and still have 223 for varmits and small game.

Most people aren't douche nozzles in person but everyone is on the Internet.

Allot of irony in this post ^

"It still doesn't change the fact that the greatest battlefield rifle of all time ( the AK ) is a pretty lousy personal survival weapon."

What do you do on a battlefield? You do your best to kill the oppisiton and survive. Which makes the AK a battlefield/survival rifle.

Ask any current soldier/marine in the service now that has done a few tours in the sand, and ask them how often their m16/m4's jam.

M16/m4 require constant attention before and after gun fights in order to keep operating.

Look up colts test on its current military rifle and you will notice they had to go to a heavier barrel due to the current barrel getting too hot and causing it to warp.
They ran 5 30rd mag's threw it and video'd the barrel bending after constant fire.

Seems military was complaining of rifle's exploding during firefights.