mike brown vs. eric garner

[GhostTX]

I'd like to see what Garner did to justify the takedown the cops did on him. Race has nothing to do with this, and if he was really a threat, and the takedown was justified, then the only thing wrong here is Garners bad health. Thanks to technology, it's much harder for the 5-0 to do whatever the fuck they want, and I think it's great, hopefully they think twice about abusing their power.

They were there to arrest him for selling black market cigarettes created by liberal-topia NYC taxes on tobacco products. The fact that he didn't comply with them to be arrested is why he finally got taken down.

Cops can't go, "oh, he doesn't want to be arrested so we'll go now."

[bcoop]

The 30 or prior arrests aren't enough? I doubt they were all for felonies but still he has an extensive criminal history and has resisted before. Looking at how it went down the officers expected resistance and planned accordingly. He'd been arrested previously for this exact same alleged crime.

Also people need to know that in NYC a pack of cigarettes is around $14.00. He wasn't peddling candy bars for a school charity, the dude should have been making some serious cash. Spend $4 for a pack of Carltons in Jersey and make $20 selling them as singles in NY. You can go even cheaper if smuggle in stuff.

lol

[BP]

I'd like to see what Garner did to justify the takedown the cops did on him. Race has nothing to do with this, and if he was really a threat, and the takedown was justified, then the only thing wrong here is Garners bad health. Thanks to technology, it's much harder for the 5-0 to do whatever the fuck they want, and I think it's great, hopefully they think twice about abusing their power.

The 30 or prior arrests aren't enough? I doubt they were all for felonies but still he has an extensive criminal history and has resisted before. Looking at how it went down the officers expected resistance and planned accordingly. He'd been arrested previously for this exact same alleged crime.

Also people need to know that in NYC a pack of cigarettes is around $14.00. He wasn't peddling candy bars for a school charity, the dude should have been making some serious cash. Spend $4 for a pack of Carltons in Jersey and make $20 selling them as singles in NY. You can go even cheaper if smuggle in stuff.

[Mach1]

I'd like to see what Garner did to justify the takedown the cops did on him. Race has nothing to do with this, and if he was really a threat, and the takedown was justified, then the only thing wrong here is Garners bad health. Thanks to technology, it's much harder for the 5-0 to do whatever the fuck they want, and I think it's great, hopefully they think twice about abusing their power.

[Broncojohnny]

I'll add "reduce risk of death by cop" to my list of reasons I "Yes sir, no sir" reply to everything a cop says.

Pretty sad that this country has devolved to that.

[DON SVO]

I'm a bit late to the game but I'll throw in my 2 shitty cents... A seatbelt hold isn't going to be very effective as a "choke hold"... An MMA submission hold either cuts blood flow to the brain (he was both quite conscious and breathing and talking well after being released) or is a joint crank (neck/spine, his neck wasn't broken which could have caused asphyxiation). He released once the guy said he couldn't breathe.

That's a different cop. There was still another cop on his back, which is the cause of death, according to the medical examiner. He couldn't breath with someone on his back.

You kind of proved the grand jury's reasoning for not pursuing charges... The "choke hold" wasn't the direct cause of his death. The additional weight of the cops on top of his blubbery physique seemed to be the catalyst. The grand jury was pursuing whether the "choke hold" killed him. It didn't.

PS Mr. Grammar Nazi: breathe

Cops can arrest them. Cops can't choke the fuck out of them and jump on their backs until they suffocate and die. Please note the subtle the difference.

Again, the grand jury ruled the "choke hold" didn't kill him. Did the weight of the cops playing piggy back ride possibly facilitate killing him? Interesting theory and certainly one I might question.

Are you saying the grand jury was a panel of his peers, fellow officers? The father didn't have an increased duty of care, he acted as a reasonable father would after finding out his daughter had been raped. Cops should act appropriately with their station in life. This guy didn't.

You're mixing terminology. Juries don't rule on probable cause, they are there to weigh the facts against the law and make a determination.

Correct. They ruled that the "choke hold" did not kill him.

I'll add "reduce risk of death by cop" to my list of reasons I "Yes sir, no sir" reply to everything a cop says.

Goddamn right. Do whatever you have to do to avoid giving the police a chance to terminate your heartbeat.

It's a sad deal for sure, but it seems his obesity and (presumably) poor health might have been a huge, fat factor. Pun intended.

[CexMashean]

I'll add "reduce risk of death by cop" to my list of reasons I "Yes sir, no sir" reply to everything a cop says.

[Mach1]

Garner's last words..

wow........

[Sean88gt]

Apparently, you have to tell a cop at least 11 times before they get it.

Garner's last words..

[Sean88gt]

Not missing any issue.
Grand Jury determines if there is enough evidence (read probable casue) to hold case over for trial.
In THIS case the 23 grand juruors decided that based on the evidence, probable cause to issue a warrant and hold over for trial did not exist. So they did not return a "true" bill. It's very simple.

On the civil side of this, NYPD cuts a big check and its done deal.

He's LE, of course he misses the issue. He'd defend ANY use of force, in any circumstance. He's done it on here plenty of times. I don't know if it stems from becoming jaded after years on the job, or if it's the attitude that is pushed from the top down. Maybe a little of both. Cops have always had leeway when it comes to enforcing the law and doing their jobs. It seems that leeway has given them the opinion that they can do whatever the fuck the want with no consequence. I think they do deserve a little leeway, in all honesty. But it needs to be reigned way the fuck in.

Enough said. Glad I'm not 1. black and, 2. in his presence.

Wait a tick. Is this dcs guy in LE? That would explain a LOT over the past couple of years.

You guys are arguing with dcs13? Don't you realize he never reads anything before responding to it, he just starts hitting those keys, thinking his opinion is too valuable to hold up for things like actual facts or data that in any way relate to what he is talking about?

[bcoop]

You're still transposing, and clearly missing the issue here.

He's LE, of course he misses the issue. He'd defend ANY use of force, in any circumstance. He's done it on here plenty of times. I don't know if it stems from becoming jaded after years on the job, or if it's the attitude that is pushed from the top down. Maybe a little of both. Cops have always had leeway when it comes to enforcing the law and doing their jobs. It seems that leeway has given them the opinion that they can do whatever the fuck the want with no consequence. I think they do deserve a little leeway, in all honesty. But it needs to be reigned way the fuck in.

[dcs13]

You're still transposing, and clearly missing the issue here.

Not missing any issue.
Grand Jury determines if there is enough evidence (read probable casue) to hold case over for trial.
In THIS case the 23 grand juruors decided that based on the evidence, probable cause to issue a warrant and hold over for trial did not exist. So they did not return a "true" bill. It's very simple.

On the civil side of this, NYPD cuts a big check and its done deal.