Anyone into car audio?

[Gasser64]

Yeah I'm loving the Zapco. I also like the fact that they're American owned and operated.

Has anyone ever looked into the issue that this video addresses? Every time I've upgraded my car audio, in various vehicles over the years, I've always run into this. I'm sure you've always heard, that the OEM speakers are sort of tailored by the engineers for that particular vehicle. They're a good fit, for the size, shape, and overall sound of the vehicle.

But we all want upgrades, right? Well one thing I've noticed is that sometimes, you can lose something, in the upgrade. Somehow, even though certain aspects of the sound may have improved, sometimes you actually take a downgrade in some areas, when you change speakers from the factory setup. How do you audio pros around here, address this issue? I guess it is the midbass. Do you always end up having to build something, like in this vid?

[LaserSVT]

Zapco makes some great amps and some okay amps. The one you got is an entry level amp but still very clean. I can usually find deals though if you ever are looking. I have a buddy selling a 5 channel Audison 5.600 amp for $300 and thats a very sweet little amp. He also has some PHD 6.1 components he is selling cheap. DIYMA has deals that are amazing from time to time.
I put my TM65 mids up for sale for $180 and sold them in 5 minutes. They were only $220 new. Yet I have my $300 AMT tweeters up for sale for $150 and nobody is biting. LOL

I have not had the privilege to hear any current CDT speakers but liked Cliff Designs back in the day.

But I am always willing to help people find deals. Like the Focals we just got. What a deal! I ordered the 2-way set for $638 which was already a smoking deal for the Focal K2 Powers. Well I do a lot of business with them and they ran out of stock and after saying I would wait they called me up the next week and said it would be two more weeks but would I mind if they sent me the 3-way version for the same price....... hells yeah! Thats a $2300 kit ($1500 if you shop well). So we ordered a $1000 kit for $638 and got the $2300 kit. LOL

I get free stuff sent to me all the time for review. Some I have to send back, some I get to keep (I have the Klippel prototype TM65s )and some I get at a discount like I can buy these Scan Speaks really cheap if i wanted them, like .20 on the dollar.


But I have lots of good frieds in the buisiness and am always willing to help members out here. i will never forget the kindness and help I got from people here just 5 years ago when times were extra hard.

[Gasser64]

Every speaker manufacturer makes many lines of product. To lump a brand into "best" or "worst" is not really possible save a few. Focal makes automotive speaker sets from $100/pr to $20,000/set. Also, higher end speakers will always require wire, deadener, proper installation, and quality amplification to have an optimum experience. I have not heard the Sinfoni so I have no comment on how no Focal speaker can sound as good as these but when the Sinfoni become an ashtray, LaserSVT will say that about his next magic drivers too.

Thanks!

Never thought we had an issue. LOL Shiner beer on me next time in Waco.

We don't, he has no idea what he's talking about. It was a real question, and thanks for the answer. There are just so many brands out there, its hard for an audio noob to make a selection. Everyone will have a different recommendation, but I was kind of starting to zero in on focals as being some of the best. I ended up going with CDT's off of woofers etc, after some research. They don't sell that exact set anymore, but they were $180 for 4 speakers, tweets, mids, and the... what the heck are those things called that you put in line before the speakers...

Here's the amp I went with for them. All budget gear, but still a hell of an upgrade over factory 94 Mustang sound. Heard Zapco was an american made product so I went with them after my RF died. POS.

http://www.woofersetc.com/p-11794-st-4x-zapco-4-channel-320w-rms-class-ab-studio-x-series-full-range-amplifier.html

[LaserSVT]

Here are the Grandioso:



[img]




I would put $1000 on the table betting that all things being equal and these being paired with a pair of AD 8" subs that they would beat the $20,000 Focal Utopias which come with two tweeters, two 6.5" mids and two 8" woofers. If they sounded like the Maesteoso not only would they be louder but also more accurate.


But you are talking super high end and if you listened to a song on one and a different song on the other you wouldnt notice any difference but if you A/B them off the same source unit you will hear details in the Sinfoni that the Focal wont reproduce and there will be less fatigue at higher volumes.
You have to admit, as great as Focal tweeters are they can wear you out pretty easy due to their natural bump from 12-18k.

[LaserSVT]

My post was really just in general. When people start asking "what is the best..." there are just way too many variables like budget, power, mounting location, proper install, etc x eleventybillion. Even if a person chooses a high dollar speaker, if they don't commit to (invest in) the other parts of a "system", their factory deck (or worse) is not going to make those speakers sound worth a crap. Go listen to some speakers on similar power to what you'll be running and buy what sounds best to you and fits your budget. Your car is not going to sound like my $7K demo board system without some investment.

I get what you are saying though. And i do get caught up in the hype and I get over excited when waiting on a new speaker and all that. I have been through every single brand that exists except AD and Jamo. Some people LOVE a ken wood Coaxial and others swear by Mb Quart or JL Audio. Being I have had the good fortune to play with so many higher end brands I do have what I think may be a somewhat educated opinion on various brands.
You are welcome to come hear my truck. You may absolutely hate the thing. You may not. I am simply pointing out that from 60-4000 hz I have NEVER heard a single driver that can do it so well.

For instance I have a remix song by an artist called Haim. She has an okay voice and the autotune makes her sound pretty nice. Well in this remix there is a drum kick (synthesized) thats around 120ish HZ. Every time that note hits (and lingers for a second or so) she also starts her line to the song. Every other 6.5" I have tested (Boston Pro, Boston Z, Hertz ML1600 1st and 2nd gen, Focal K2, Focal Flax, Illusion C6 Carbon, Stereo Integrity TM65, MB Quart Onyx, Infinity Kappa Perfect, Infinity Kappa, Dynaudio Esotar2 650, Micro Precision 5 and 7 series, Dayton Classic, Dayton HO, Peerless and Hertz HSK) all have her vocals get muddy for that first second until the bass note subsides. Now the Focal K2 Power 3-way component set does not have that issue as it has 3" taking over at 400ish hz but in a two way the Sinfoni does not get mussy at all.
Elton Johns "Levon" has a guitar that comes in on the right channel after 30 seconds or so. I always hear the guitar but with these the guitar is prominent. With Robert Plants "In The Mood" the high hat in the instrumental part of the song sounds like the drummer is there. So many Fleetwood Mac songs I never heard Christie McVee take a breath between versus but I can hear it now. I was just listening to a Rush song on the way home (forget which) and I had never heard the rapid background synthesized drum track before. It was just too quiet and so many other parts are louder so the driver has a hard time also making that soft background sound yet these do it and it makes the music seem more alive.
Joe Walsh sounds like hes in the passenger seat singing about doing 185 in his Maserati.


I am simply in awe of these speakers and its not fair to call them speakers. they don't reproduce sound, they are the sound.

I can give you Emilios number if you wish. He never tries to push a product on you and will shoot you straight. hell he wouldn't even let me buy the tweeters until he made sure I was in love with the mids and not satisfied with the Scan Speak tweeters. He worked for Dynaudio and has just an overwhelming amount of knowledge. he loves talking about it and I am sure would love to tell you why they do what they do and what he has first hand designed for other companies and just about anything audio related.
I am also talking with couple other people you may know if you are big into the sound competitions that they always score big or win or are judges for. They are doing complete Sinfoni builds right now because the Sinfonis are just spectacular.


The Grandiosos are something to behold and some day i hope to afford a set but at $6000..... yikes!

[LaserSVT]

No car will ever sound like any demo board. My last shop we had a $12,000 board with $22,000 in components and amps and while you get a general idea, car environment is just way too different.


BTW, I has birthday cake so everything else does not currently matter. LOL

[inline 6]

I have a pair of JL 10w6v3

[EW]

My post was really just in general. When people start asking "what is the best..." there are just way too many variables like budget, power, mounting location, proper install, etc x eleventybillion. Even if a person chooses a high dollar speaker, if they don't commit to (invest in) the other parts of a "system", their factory deck (or worse) is not going to make those speakers sound worth a crap. Go listen to some speakers on similar power to what you'll be running and buy what sounds best to you and fits your budget. Your car is not going to sound like my $7K demo board system without some investment.

[LaserSVT]

Sure thing. What kind of sub?

[inline 6]

I am going to redo the sub box in my jeep when I get my router going. I am thinking I want to go ported for a little more spl. I may have to pick your brain

[LaserSVT]

I should point out that no matter what price a speaker is, they all require wire and a proper installation and sound dampening is ALWAYS a plus.
I made the stock Bose system sound better in a Denali last week just by adding sound deadener. LOL

[LaserSVT]

Ahhhh, so sorry. Never thought we had an issue. LOL Shiner beer on me next time in Waco.

[inline 6]

The post was not directed at you. It was directed at Justin.

[LaserSVT]

Every speaker manufacturer makes many lines of product. To lump a brand into "best" or "worst" is not really possible save a few. Focal makes automotive speaker sets from $100/pr to $20,000/set. Also, higher end speakers will always require wire, deadener, proper installation, and quality amplification to have an optimum experience. I have not heard the Sinfoni so I have no comment on how no Focal speaker can sound as good as these but when the Sinfoni become an ashtray, LaserSVT will say that about his next magic drivers too.

Didn't mean that to come off so blunt. I am a HUGE Focal fan. From the Flax to Utopia they all are great. I have some K2 Powers I just installed in the shop car this week and love them. The Sinfoni is just different, it has a substantial amount more of mid bass and they can extend to a much higher frequency. That's kind of a non-issue with the Focal set I just did as it has a dedicated 3" mid o take over those duties. The K2 Powers have the typical resonation after 2000hz like every other 6.5" has. Somehow in the Sinfoni they seemed to have adjusted for that and the driver can extend to 8000hz (so they claim) but I have them at 3.15k. Also the Utopia Be is one of my all time favorite tweeters.
With the Sinfoni I was a non believer and was content to stick with what I knew. I then watched a few friends run tests and compared them back to back with Dynaudio and Micro Precision and Hat and the Sinfoni was always the favorite. I tried the same but could only back to back them with the SI TM65, Focal K2 Power and the Dynaudio Esotar2 650. Sure enough they were the superior sounding driver.
They tweeters may suck and I will stick with the Scans if that is the case but I want to test the Sinfoni tweeters for myself just so I know if they are any good.

Don't feed the troll. He does not give a fuck he just desires to spew worthless bullshit all over the site.

That seems to be an undeserved comment. Not sure who pissed in your post toasties and was not aware we had issues. On that note you can just go ahead and fuck off. There are plenty of other threads here you can get pissed at.

[inline 6]

Don't feed the troll. He does not give a fuck he just desires to spew worthless bullshit all over the site.